Shroud of the Avatar: Calls for Art
On the Shroud of the Avatar developer forum, project technical director Chris Spears has put out a pair of notices for the community, asking for art submissions. The first requests “something fairly easy”: house props.
As this will be our first call for art, we’re going to start off with something fairly easy to give people a chance to get their feet wet! We’re looking for house decorations and props!
While not super exciting, it is something we will need a LOT of variations on to keep our crafters happy! This is not one where we’re only going to accept the best chair. If your chair fits our art style, we’ll use it!
For this exercise, we’re going to offer a $10 bounty per item we use. We’ll go up from there once we get into bigger stuff. You can choose how to receive your reward on the submission page.
Here is Stephen’s concept image to help spark your imagination! If you have an idea of your own, then feel free to run with it but anything on the image is a pretty safe image.
Full size version be downloaded here: http://goo.gl/oYvOM
The second, meanwhile, is a bit more short notice:
This one is a fairly high priority and short notice. Bill has been requesting some crypt decorations for his map that he was hoping could be shown to some extent in early July. He has a fabulous art set for it but needs more decorations. All the artists are booked. We could really use some simple “ruined crypt” type props. We don’t have a concept so this one is on you guys. Some examples are:
Broken urns – $5 each bounty
Spider webs, various sizes that can be used in corners and ceilings(Bill really wants these) – $5 each bounty
Spider egg sacks – $10 bounty
Bone piles -$10 bounty
Stone sarcophagus – $10 bounty
Skulls – $5 each bounty
Rusty sword – $10 bounty
Rusty shield – $10 bounty
rusty breast plate – $20 bounty
Iron maiden (doors as separate pieces) – $20 bounty
Iron cage (black metal, round type to hang people in) – $20 bounty
Guillotine (Blade 1m across, on 4 m pole) – $10 bounty
Sacrificial altar – $20 bountyWe could use a couple variations on each of these, especially skulls. Bill wants to fill his dungeons with skulls that you can use as soccer balls!
You can find guidlines on how to submit assets (via Unity) to Portalarium here.
This is reprehensible. We’re witnessing the evolution of yet another way employers can bypass paying people fairly for their time. On the flip side, if you’re skilled enough to generate assets at the level of quality required for the game, you should not be selling yourself so short. STAY AWAY. Don’t let this become a trend. Don’t undermine the labor market for graphic artists.
Lastly, this game is a disgrace to the legacy of Ultima. Maybe it’s a good thing Richard Garriot doesn’t have access to the Ultima IP or he’d probably be doing irreparable damage to the name.
I am a Kickstarter of Shroud of the Avatar and a long time fan of Ultima and Origin but I wish I hadn’t contributed any money to the campaign after seeing how this project is being managed.
Portalarium announced that they’d be crowdsourcing assets for the game back during its Kickstarter campaign, so hopefully you didn’t pledge to support in ignorance of that. That they’ve now begun soliciting contributions should come as no surprise.
Or is it the rates offered that offend? But then, what else would one expect for a game being made on what is probably not all that much more than a shoestring budget?
He just hates that people are willing to help a company on a budget out because it might take jobs away from people who do it professionally… even though it wouldn’t.
You’re more wrong than you could ever be. Crowdsourcing is a fantastic thing, especially for companies that can’t dump mega amounts of money into a game or are on a time schedule or just want to get players more involved which in turn makes them more interested in playing and supporting. It also allows people who are looking to get into game design as a career to get their foot in the door and something to put on their portfolio. Just like any other job out there, most employers want to hire people with experience. Well, this is a great way to get in on that experience while supporting a project.
I myself am one of these people supporting and creating content that will hopefully be in SOTA. I see it not as selling myself short, but as all the above reasons I mentioned and I certainly need no ones permission or acceptance to do so. You don’t like it? Go back to playing old Ultima games and living in the past while the rest of us strive to move forward in an industry that needs to progress and change the way it does things. If anyone is a disgrace, it’s “fans” like you.
You’re not only selling yourself short, but you’re selling every other graphic artist short at the same time. Way to participate in undermining the labor market. I’m sure you’ll wise up but by then you and the people like you will have destroyed the labor market. If you want to create a portfolio, then do so without giving your work away or selling it for less than it’s worth like everyone else did before this “fantastic thing” came around.
Its not undermining the labor market. They are paying above the rate for assets on the Unity store, and allowing you to keep your rights to the asset so you can continue to sell it on the Unity store. That is one of the most empowering things a Unity game developer has ever done.
If you are a professional artist and are looking for a staff position, you are in the wrong forum.
Yes, the labor market is so “destroyed”. You’re living in a pipe dream, man. There will always be a market for graphic designers where the big boys are concerned. People like EA aren’t going to rely on crowdsourcing to put a game out. Not when they have tens of millions of dollars being invested in a project. You’re confusing large scale games with the indy market. SOTA has two main designers. That is what the company can afford. If we want to have a working alpha with a good amount of content by December, crowd interaction, be able to create a buzz about the game, then crowdsourcing a lot of the more less important tasks to people who actually want to do it is the best way to do it.
Also, UltimaFan, I’m not a graphic designer but I’ve also been in my industry likely a lot longer than you and do it professionally. I see SOTA as a fun way to give back to someone who gave to me worlds growing up and do so because I want to and because I want to see this game succeed into the greatness that was the Ultima series.
As I said, no one is forcing you to make content, so don’t. However, at least try to comprehend in that arrogant mind of yours that this is not the type of game that has millions to spend on graphics alone unlike many other games.
You obviously have no comprehension of what a tiny little seed can grow into. You also are not comprehending the true debate I was starting. Your shortsightedness is all too common. By participating in so-called “crowdsourcing,” you are helping to fuel a movement and a trend that could have disastrous consequences for laborers of all kinds.
Continue to attack me personally. It only goes to show your counter-arguments are hollow.
You really are in denial, aren’t you, UltimaFan? You sound like you’re someone who put an application into Portalarium and they didn’t give you a job so now you’re bitter about it. I’ve had no problems getting work in this industry. If you lack paying work, maybe the problem isn’t that there aren’t any jobs available due to crowdsourcing.
Bottom line: the gaming industry will always need hired professionals as leads. While many companies in the future may go to crowdsourcing, and I hope they do because it brings in fresh minds and great content, there will never be a substitution for a lead designer.
I do not lack work and never implied as such. I’m a successful professional in a completely different field.
As you have continued with the personal attacks and you continually miss the point of my argument, I see no point in continuing a debate with you. Farewell.
It’s sad to see how far Garriot, and Ultima with him, has fallen.
He lives in the shadow of his former employee, Chris Roberts.
UltimaFan, were you outraged back in 2003 when EA closed down the official Ultima Online forums, and basically put a fansite in charge of the semi-official forums, forums which are still being used here in 2013? Are you outraged by the fact that Mythic pushes community management for its three MMORPGs (Dark Age of Camelot, Ultima Online, Warhammer Online) off to fansites? As a matter of fact, Mythic recently laid off the ONLY community manager for all three MMORPGs.
After all, it means EA no longer has to pay for community management personnel which, by your definition, means they are undermining the labor market for community management personnel.
And are you upset when companies release games earlier than they should, or use beta or alpha testers from the fans?
After all, they are undermining the labor market for Q&A personnel. Just ask SimCity fans, who have basically been beta testing SimCity for the past few months. If EA had employed a comprehensive Q&A program up front, they wouldn’t still be fixing stupid little crap that would have been caught before the game ever shipped.
If you want to be outraged, be outraged at billion-dollar companies like EA that have thousands of employees, and yet have piss-poor management and cost-cutting measures that basically push a lot of the marketing and community management off to fansites.
I’m sure RG would love to have a full compliment of artists, but he’s doing what he has to do with the budget he has.
Of course, he could farm all the art assets out to some Chinese company that pays very little, saving a lot of money, and DEFINITELY undermining the labor market for graphic artists. It’s what EA does all the time. Instead he gives the fans a chance to do something, and make a little money on the side.
And who knows, they could be using this as a potential recruiting tool.
Deckard (Cain?), sure, I’m outraged at all those things.
Elizabeth & Abraham (EA) are evil, as was clearly shown in Ultima VII.
I’m old enough to remember a time when this industry had phone-in support for every title, where you could talk to an actual human being about your game freezing or just to get a game hint. It’s sad to see the way customers are treated today.
I also remember a time when game development was about creativity, passion, and art. The business types have been slowly turning it into an impersonal, inhuman machine for the production of shallow, expendable entertainment media to turn a profit for shareholders. This is also the reason I do not play and could care less about 99.9% of games out there today.
Kudos to those who are still developing games as art and for the passion of it. However, please do not support “crowd sourcing.” If you let this seed grow, the implications in the labor market will have far greater negative impact than any of the positives of the movement which have been mentioned. You’ll find the eventual career or paycheck you were hoping for will be very disappointing if you demonstrate you (and many like you) will trade your skilled labor for less than the labor market for professionals in your field. Game development studios will no longer have a reason to employ you when they can crowd source those same assets. You will undermine the very market you are hoping to enter. The same business people who turned your (and my) beloved Ultima franchise into what it is today (a sad farce unworthy of even the name) will ruin your chance at trading your skills for fair compensation if too many people are short-sighted enough to support and be involved in this movement.
If you are an artist in the early stages of your career, consider posting your portfolio online instead.
Consider also that art with non-exclusive rights is art which will be art that is cheapened and with little impact because it will be everywhere. I personally do not want to play a generic game with generic assets either purchased or crowd-sourced. I want to play a work of art crafted by someone with a clear vision and the passion to create worlds. You will not make a name for yourself by contributing generic assets.
Deckard is a Reference to a Ridley Scott movie of the early ’80s.
“However, please do not support “crowd sourcing.”
There is no difference between crowd sourcing and pre-ordering, because both are taking the money of would-be players before the game is completed. A pre-order maybe further along than a crowd-sourced game, but at the end of the day, your money is still going towards a game that is not yet complete, and therefore it is funding its completion.
If you are talking about crowd sourcing in regards to development, nobody is being cut out of the labor pool if the game would not happen any other way.
And I could make a damn good case that outsourcing art elements for $50 million and $100 million games to China like EA and the others do does far more to depress the labor market here than crowd-sourcing/development of a small game made by an independent publisher.
Deckard, I think you’re confusing crowd sourcing with crowd funding. There’s a big difference there. There’s nothing wrong with the concept of crowd funding per se, although it can be abused. Unfortunately, it’s starting to be used as a glorified pre-ordering system with inflated prices, instead of its intended purpose to give developers the opportunity to seek alternative funding for exciting new concepts that otherwise would never see the light of day. The crowd funding model is actually quite nice in its ideal form, because it removes the middle-man (publisher) between the producer (developer) and consumer (gamer). But we’re seeing producers with obvious financial means and no valid reason to seek this type of funding put their products on Kickstarter to take advantage of the craze and the inflated prices at which they can sell their products. I think that is despicable. Overall, however, the presence of crowd funding in the landscape has been positive, and many projects that we might have never seen otherwise owe their existence or at least part of their success to the phenomenon.
I don’t know if this will work like Wasteland 2’s art crowdsourcing, but with that program, your art submission goes into the Unity store, so multiple game developers can each license your art asset. If 10 people license your buckler for $10 each, then your time to create that buckler now might adequately be compensated.
For modders currently making these assets for free with no way to properly monetize them (look at all the Ultima remakes, Skyrim mods, etc) you now have a way to monetize work you already did that you couldn’t monetize before.
I posted this very idea to the SotA forums, but haven’t checked for a response. I’m done with the SotA forums given that the community on the forums seems to be very pro-griefing and the devs seem to be catering to that. Players are split. Some want to play exclusively offline to avoid the griefers, and the online folks want to be able to grief.
I offered up $100 to see a spiritual successor to Ultima. I didn’t intend to fund a griefing simulator.
I don’t think it will devolve into a way to grief other players. I’ve already put $400 toward it, and don’t want to see that either.
What some players want is open world PvP, which historically *has* been griefing. However, with the way the world will do sharding, and the ability to play in the mode you want (full online, online with friends only, or single player online), there is NO reason you will have to deal with griefers.
As the technology gets nailed down, expect to see the few people who want to grief others become very disappointed. Everyone else should be pleased.
Devs have spoken in favor of full loot on PvP kills to add risk. Players are asking for even more, being able to rob players (even in safe environments like UO), and the ability to steal loot from other people’s kills. Combine those three, and you have an environment that actively caters to griefing.
Given that the majority of development discussion has been on crafting, housing, PvP, etc. it seems like the primary focus of the game is on the online/shared features. But I will not play an online game that caters to griefers. Nor do I understand how such a design is really fun for those playing it.
There are ways to make PvP exciting and tense without punishing players and catering to griefing. You can have control points needed for a quest, where players will be unsure if they can go in solo and finish the quest without having to fight other players. They might have to recruit others to aid them in securing the area.
Mods are a great example of how games get additional content for free. Good call.
Keep in mind the reason Portalarium is on a budget is because Richard Garriot, their leader, has disgraced himself innumerable times and he failed in the last few projects he was involved with. His ego does not match his accomplishments and he clearly lacks the passion he once had. I respect his previous accomplishments but I have none for who he is today or where he is today because it is his own doing. Richard left game development and took the fortunes we the fans put into his pockets to pursue another passion. When he came back, he discovered he was irrelevant. Richard Garriot is clearly not the linchpin of an Ultima as he likes to think, because the game we’re getting is not an Ultima in spirit or in name. In fact, the new Divinity is closer than this proposed new game will probably ever be.
There. Someone said it. But you know it’s what we (longtime Ultima fans from the 90’s and earlier) are all thinking. Those who are not are blinded by false hope and in denial.
Keep in mind the reason Portalarium is on a budget is because Richard Garriot, their leader, has disgraced himself innumerable times and he failed in the last few projects he was involved with.
Ehh, speaking for myself, I don’t blame him for the problems with Tabula Rasa and Ultima IX. Tabula Rasa had far too much outside interference, and Ultima IX was affected by radical changes in technology and Ultima Online turning out to be lightning in a bottle, and EA management setting out arbitrary ship dates. As for UO2, I don’t blame Garriott either. He had no control over EA bean counters deciding the existing UO was too important to risk cannibalizing (ironic that World of Warcraft resembled UO2).
Interesting how in the 1990s, EA forced Garriott and others to ship games before they were ready, and here we are in 2013 with SimCity being shipped before it was ready. Wait, are we supposed to blame SimCity’s problems on Garriott as well 😉
Richard left game development and took the fortunes we the fans put into his pockets to pursue another passion.
As opposed to EA/Activision/Ubisoft/etc. stockholders and upper-level executives who take the money we give them or that props up their stocks and spend them on fancy houses and cars or expensive divorces?
I’d rather my money be spent on Garriott going into space than some millionaire executive or shareholder doing coke with a hooker in the backseat of their Mercedes. Same with James Cameron, I’d rather he be spending the money we throw his way going to the bottom of the ocean than Rupert Murdoch funneling it into whatever agenda he has going on at the time.
If you are concerned about how companies spend the money you give them, you are probably best off avoiding buying anything. Because I can promise you that some portion of the money you give when you purchase a product is going to go to somebody who does something you don’t like.